A discussion of Morgan (40), Sam(28), Clemens (22) and David (35)

 copyright by Dylancat

Sam: I recently came out to my mum about being ftm and with my plan to transition as soon as possible. Her first question was: Are you going to be able to father kids then? However as I had already
decided to try to bear a kid first.she's quite content, as it is.

David:: Wow!! You want to try having a kid before transitioning? Most guys that I know of have children to hide from their TS feelings. Once they realize that it's possible, the last thing they want to
do is get pregnant.

Sam: There is a lot pressure on the younger ones not to attempt it. To have a kid early as single parent is the best way to get on welfare and stay there longtime with not much support. But in my
opinion it's more than economics. They are afraid that they would loose their official ftm status with a kid. I came out to a panel of ftm because I was looking for a gay sperm donor and as most guys
are gay I hoped they'd ask around a bit.The next meeting some called me "she". Stuff like that may make a ftm step back either from the wish to become a parent or from transitioning. Now the ftm say
it's OK, but they still don't understand it and somebody suggested if it had worked I should have an abortion.Some mtf bluntly told me that I wasn't welcome anymore as I was no real TS.And of
course people approach you and say: "you want to much, you are egoistic the poor kid" or such bullshit. I 've been through so much because I'm what I am, soI think I 've certainly paid for it. And if
somebody thinks our society is discriminating queer parents, he's dammed right, but I expect that he should work to abolish that.

Morgan: my kidz love me. but i've had to fight for their love. i've had to do battle with the str8 mind in courts of so called law to keep my kids. best friends who were str8 and not homophobes turned
and abandoned my kidz due to pressues against them to conform, to exclude me. lesbians have notoriously excluded me as a butch because i have children. i'm not a real butch. Real butches have
money, not kidz. no one has supported this mom to be the mom I have become, which is a very good one. Sam: My friends, who are mostly male and my family have been supportive so far. So, on
one hand it fits nicely with my job situation, my boss really thinks I needn't come one weekends etc. and I'm really flexible with time. Besides even as a boy I have always wanted a large family. As
a scientists it's difficult to have more then one, if you are the one who gets pregnant, so it's not a too big regret that I won't have that many kids. I don't think I could bear it to delay transition for more
than say one or one and a half years. I have lived most of my life as a boy, so now as I don't pass fully anymore, it's sometimes really awful. In general I don't think parenthood is contradictionary
with transitioning. I'd lie to the shrink of course as I probably wouldn't get a letter if I plan to transition right after (which is of course what I'm going to do). Being sterile is not a true significant sign
that you're a man, you know. Most adult people want to have children, man and woman alike. So I hope that it'll work, as I had visited a gyn and she was surprised that the parts were so small, but
she told me not to worry. Of course I do. It seems to go against all laws of my society, so I'm always happy if I read books, or stuff about fictional or real ftm who have kids.

David: But, if you think that you can pull it off and still hold onto your masculinity, all the power to you.

Morgan: welp, off to ye olde local head shoppe with the kidz....grinning in my mr.mom role and thinking of yu in yerz. i want to see yu pregnant, man, yuwon't become feminine for this role will yu?

Sam: I'm curious about how it'll be long time but so far I don't feel feminine. Rather the opposite. It's fine so far, so I can only recommend it to those who are unsecured. It seems rather to emphasize
identity in either direction. I had wondered if a possible pregnancy would connect me with other women in a way that I'd have similar feelings: nope. I am certain that they won’t look forward to
become a father like me. The strength of that which is of course completely natural is surprising me. I also feel more connected to the human race. Did you ever think about having kids a family?

Clemens: Frankly, I can't understand how you can do that. It's as Dave would say the least thing, I'd like to do. Doing it would revive too much what I am truly in my biology. It’s too late anyway now
for me.

Sam: Most younger ftm have told me that. You're pretty representative here. Perhaps I've got a different attitude to my body and gender, maybe it's because I'm older. If I think of myself, I percieve
me as born male, but not allowed to mature as a man, sort of kept as a boy as I lack the natural occurring secondary sex characteristics.

Morgan: that is how i see my life too. only i hid or obliterated the secpndarysex characteristics of a grrrl on my bo(d)y.

Sam: I believe it's largely genetic. We're invisibly intersexed. So I sort of make use of my hardware as best as I can. I like my body. That's why I'm going to get the T* upgrade for him. I think we do
have options. We needn't be content to exist at the borderline of society. I have met too many TS people who just feel they are at the very bottom of society, because they as TS and resign to that.
That's the wrong way of thinking in my opinion, because it doesn't change anything. Besides it's not true, it's only that those who are down are more visible than the others. The problem is that this
exclusive heterosexual system that suppresses alternative ways of life. And of course class structures.

Morgan: freud , and then marx. freud didn't do the class analysis.n i agree with them both. that's why i call 'em both genius. they reallyfound this out.

Sam: I guess it's easy to see, I haven't read much of both. Almost nothing. But I probably picked something up, here and there, and put the picture together. I'd rather quote Leslie Feinberg on it, with
hir book "Gender Warriors".

David:: How are you going to go about doing it? I mean, are you going to have artificial inseminationor do you have someone picked out?

Morgan: yu can go to sperm banx and they will freeze sperm, then yu pop it in say for five daysnnights mid-cycle, and viola', instant baby. yu don't need insemination. play with the sperm. use a
needleless syringe to extract it frum a condom on frankie...shoot yerself up, instantly. but it's best i think jes to do it the routine wayz by fukin' if it's possible. yu want a healthy kid. it's worth it do it
withouttoo much manipulation. most people that i know o f who have inseminated have had birth defects, dykes that is, doing it on their own. i have no idea what ‘so ever if there is a conection to
insemination, but most of the inseminated babes are born prematurely, exspecially the boyz, and then theywind up with dread stuff due to lung immaturity and over doses of oxygen atbirth....so be
very thoughtful of how yu intervene with nature. try not to disturb the nature.

Sam: Artificial insermination is illegal for non-straight, nonmarried couples over here in Germany. Additionally we don't have sperm bank like you do. I might try to find a back-alley doc who does
it, but mostly I hope that Frankie and me will succeed in the next months, if we haven't already. I had asked around a lot prior finding him, he is a friend of a friend, and put adds in the queer sections.
I got plenty of replies, but after coming-out as ftm, none of the fags wanted to participate. It was too unconventional for them. Morgan, I 'd like to ask you if you recall how you felt years ago, while
pregnant. More , more feminine, more connected to women, more or less human/animal?

Morgan: Twenty-two ago, when i was plumped n full of my first child/son, Zachry, i was 19yo, married to my HS sweetheart (who had dumped me for his best friendz 14yo sister), broke, n alone,
except for Lancer, my little pound dog. I bonded with Lancer the dog, as sorta the pseudo-father of the kid, cuz he'd lick my face in bed at night when Zac-in-utero wuld kick himin the side, too, as he
curled up to my belly. Nso, i also felt much moreanimal. In fact, that dog/mom/kid relation was the beg/inning of adult consciousness of my vital connection to creaturez n land. Of course, when
inursed Zac i learned how the animality of bo(d)yz worked: my bo(d)y had alwayz produced his food. To me that was alwayz the parental imperative. Nmy defintion of "food" was tres loose. I was
butch in my appearance then: my (x)husband n his brotherz called me Steve, after Steve McQueen, cuz they said i looked like him; highly muscular frum being a dancer, shaved head, nd i wore Levi's
501 button fly jeanz forthe first four months, n overallz thru-out Zac's third tri-mester of gestation. Fast after Zac was born n i was back in the hospital room, i was donning my favorite Redskin shirt
(Larry Brown's jersey, $\#43$), and greeted visitorz looking like a tough boy. Flexing muscles in the bed. I felt predominantly butch as any hell raiser; i had jes produced a boy-child outtamy own
womb. that jazzed me.I did not feel more feminine, but still the feminine image was imposed uponme externally. i was given, by my mom n her friendz, and wore begrudingly nwith all sortz of
humiliationzzz, maternity clothes for a woman. I wear/woremenz clothez. Having to be examined pelvically repulsed me to an exaggerated degree, i thought. Sitting in the docz office who delivered
me n my mom nZac was also humiliating in an (en)gendered way: that space was woman's space, n fundamentally at the surface o' my skinz i didn't fit in.Nso, overwhelmingly, combining the animal
closeness, my butch gender id, nsocially constructed pressurezzz to conform to traditionz, i felt alien. Not inferior tho--instead, i felt oddly super(hu)man. the first kid.

Sam: Well, for me it's just pretty much beginning, but when I went to work the morning after Frankie and me had tried, I surprisingly felt more human than ever. Really conneted to human society. But
in the last weeks, I've of course wondered if we have already succeded or not. So if you always closely try to sense something, you may also sense a bit discomfort, and that made me experiecing
some animal closeness. After all my tabby cat Tehanu has had many litters and is going to have an additional soon. My name cousin, your son Sam is visiting you right now. How is he?

Morgan: terrific, strong, handsome, excruciatingly smart, n adorable.

Sam: How does he react to you as you as now sort of both father and mother to him.

Morgan: nope, not at all. first, he has no reason to react to me. i'm the very same person. we're up front about everything. he's glad i'm gonna live thru silicone poisoning. and has lived thru the
prejudice against me, nso, he's glad i'll have a much better likihood of passing as a man .my kidz taught me how to parent myself.my kidz taught me how to parent them. my kidz taught me how to play.
on yer pregnancy :isn't it perplexing how sum folx view intercourse? exspecially real men? when there is a real dick attached to the brain-bo(d)y gendered relationzare more (trans)fixed. i think it's a
very interesting question to ax how men feel when they are used for their DNA donationzzzzz. it is rather a power role reversal spot yu put them in, don't cha think?

Sam: Frankie thought it might be easier for me if he was to be the woman at sometime, so I had to ashure him that I 'd see him as a man, too, before it worked. It's strange that making kids is so
strictly connected with heterosexuality. But sometimes I'm still scared because I transgress so many law of our society by doing it, because I decided for both things consciously. It won't hold me
back, I've got a history of doing such things. I only mention it because I think others might feel similar and wonder about it. It's probably normal if you have been raised in a society whereat seemed
to be a fixed law of nature that only women were allowed to bear kids. So I'm thankful that I 've got some literary role-models. I really recommend Ursula Le Guins "The left hand side of darkness",
this short-story form Marion Zimmer Bradley called "Adam's rip" and the books of Cordwainer Smith. Plenty tales about crossing gender boundaries and who are also dealing with the problem of
progeneration. After all what could all those gay ftm on that planet of Cordwainer Smith do else *grin* ?It has been also common in native American societies, that two spirited people conceived.
So it has been done. But I don't understand, I can't follow your line of thinking but my partner certainly felt that he was put in the female role. Don't know why, why shouldn't two guys father a kid.
Morgan: this is what i meant--he is only wanted for a very highly specificfunction--to progenerate. it is a role reversal for a guy, not the specific guy yu have with yu, but the male role model we
have to bear and are in fact bending now with our bo(d)yz. remember women wer taught to fuk--lie thereand think of england, this is yer national duty to progenerate. that is what i was thinking.
social norms, not about how men are. Sam: You can't tell me of power games in straight relationships, the worst go on in butch-butch or ftm/ftm relationships. Like two people always wanting to sit
on the same chair. Simply power games for no reason at all but putting the other down, probably because you are full of internalized homophobia.I have no need to put men down cause they are men.
After all I'm one myself.

Morgan: i was saying i like them to fuk me....not that i don't like men, in fact i adore men, in all their variousnesses, but not homophobes. i am a man, not a woman, a wombed man. i do not know
what the categories man and woman are all about and shit i' m a road scholar of gender. the more i find out, the less it is clear to me that there are any differences.

Sam: For me the difference is social, manifesting itself in the comunnication patters and not to be located in the individual. Gender is created through the interactions of indiviaduals, not a traceble
characteristic of the indidvidual. I don't say it's not there, only that's a cooperaticve effect.

Morgan: But largely i feel this way cuz i have chosen to be whom i am. but my biology acts according to what i choose. if i try to be a grrrl i get sick, depressed, don't fit in. if i perform my boyness i
feel confident and real. that is who i am and am not.

Sam: I feel completely invisible when people refer to me as a female- like a ghost. So I do tend to dominate conversations to get some direct interaction. A recent development is that I become
quickly insulted if somebody knows I'm ftm and thinks because I'm prior T* I need't get the respected as a man. Like as it was some sacred transition ritual.

Clemens: When people percieved me as a girl, I was completely finished. It took days to recover when I was in RLT. Of course, that's different now. Now people think that my old first name: Manja
is a male one. It's incredibly funny. Nobody imagines I could be a girl or even a transsexual. I like that. When I remember that I used to be completely shy, that I wasn't able to hold a conversation,
nowadays that's a thing difficult to imagine. I really gained lot's of self-confidence.

Morgan: now there is a male consciousness--it takes patriarchal privilege and uses for it's own advantages. this is political. domination of species, legalized to keep wealth in their lineage. this is
not okay by me and isolate men with so little social consciousness that they keep this system going for their own advantages. there is a female consciousness that fights against such domination. i am
there. and if yer guy was so un-misogynistic, then why was it not okay by him to be in the "female position"?????? what's wrong with being in the female position? and who decided it was a female
position?

Sam: Hey, it was because a matter of identity, similar to me being stone when I had a straight b/f. Just a communication issue. It destroys the communication if you are not acknowledged in your
identity. Sex is basically communication.

Morgan: yes sir. i agree. this is why i say the sexiest place in the world for mein the written word. it creates images in my head. What you are doing, in my opinion, provides a more reasonable
model of how to make offspring. [than the heterosexual one] with mutual choice in the matter. whether you like it or not, the male model of domination does not offer this, and it is wrong. it killed our
grandmothers and ruined their lives, made of them slaves to male progenation. i hold males responsible for their domination and ignorance. all males who participate in such shit. all. if females
participate in their own demise i hold them accountable too.

Sam: Women have so much power, but they wield it in secret like the mafia.We can't participate in these structures because we're ftm. I think the pate, the godfather of a "honorable society" wields
an almost female power.

Morgan:i am attracted to men. masculinity. exspecially now in my transition, but I am choosey as to what type of masculinity i like. around he'ah there is acult of redneck maleness that is nauseous,
like a noxious gas that pollutes. that kind of masculinity is aggressive in mean wayz, hostile towardz mymaleness. he'ah there is a feminism that is equally noxious. suffocating asa matter of fact. but i
do understand that it happnez here like this cuz there is so much hate for difference, and such a high price to pay for being different than tradition would dictate my kidz love me. but i' ve had to fight
for their love. i' ve had to do battle with the str8 mind in courts of so called law to keep my kids. best friends who were str8 and not homophobes turned and abandoned my kidz due to pressues
against them to conform, to exclude me. lesbians have notoriously excluded me as a butch because i have children. i'm not a real butch. Real butches have money, not kidz. no one has supported this
mom to be the mom ihave become, witch is a very good one .but it's the most empowering place of my life--motherhood. i learned how to argue myself because of my love for my kidz. they drew me
into my manliness with their acceptances of me as their own special mom. i became strong for myself in my attempt to be there on all these illustrious occasions. I became the best i can be because of
honoring a deep commitment to them.i am theirs, they are not mine. that is what adult is--capable of giving without needing it returned to survive. They come to momma, with all sorts of respect, i
know my dreams for us came true--we built a world of understanding and love of our own. it's small, but it's ours. and it is the fruit of our labor now---cuz now they choose ifthey want me to still be
their special mom. and they still call me mom. Even though they know, i' m the tranzman. and they've alwayz known. no secrets.if yer not realizing how much of a growth process for yu parenting is,
hold on to yer seat, cuz yer about to go into one hell of a crazy spiral. And frum my point of view, it's not only the best spin around, it's worth everytwist.

Sam: often an ftm 's status is the one of a kid. Morgan: i dunno where yu been man, but my status is not of a boy or a child and noone, but no one treats me as such.

Sam : No, I want to say that before hormones best I can do is to pass for a teenage boy. People still ask me if I’m over or under 16. And as ftm, one lacks the social skills of an adult woman.

Morgan: this is also not true. i am not thought of to lack any social skill, or be anything less than an adult. a very masculine adult.

Sam : Still, women think you are immature because you're not fitting in or that you're rude accordingly to their standards.

Morgan: Ah, now this is very true on the not fitting/rude. but not the immature. most women are turned on by me and see me as a viable sex partner, and that is what freaks them out, cuz i'm talking
about the straight ones. the queer ones are freaked cuz i look like and act like men they've known and hence they think this is not a lesbian.

Sam : And men sometimes adopt that attitude.

Morgan: The men think i am a boy, for sure. i ask. :-) i asked a dean i was working with in Cincinnati the week before last when we hugged to saygoodbye. i asked him if he thought of me as a
lesbian, a woman, a man, ora fag? he said a boy, 19. that is about how i feel sumtimes, especially when surrounded by huge str8 men.one of the reasons i am suing for sexual harassment here is
because i am manly and not the right kind of dyke for these misandrogynists! jes cuz idon't reject men as capable of feminism because they are not women, i was pushed out of the dyke feminist
circle. jes cuz i id as male, a male wholoves women and men jes cuz i id as male, a male who loves women and men.

Sam: This makes a ftm an easy victim for sexual harassment, as the women have made it clear that their support will be minimal. You are singled out by them for anybody who is in the position to
abuse power.

Morgan: yes indeed, sir. you nailed it on the very head. and i don't capitulate with that abuse. i fight like a transgendered warrior, like a man. and it has rightly caught them by surprise. Sam: Do you
have any support by the women in your department?

Morgan: Of course not, they were the onez who tried to kick me out and prevent mefrum getting my degree. i had to go outside of the department, work with themen, who adore me, and get my degree
in women's studies. the men professors treated me with such respect and professionalism; the women were irrational and emotional hysterics at every turn. that was not the case in the graduate
women's studies program in south carolina. the women there were professional and first rate!!! nothing like these, what?

Sam: I have been in a pretty similar situation. That's why I try to stay away as far as I can from women, at least ere I've transitioned fully.

Morgan: maybe i should consider the very same, for now, anyway.(i don't even fukin believe this--it's one of those hellish electrical strmz here and i am getting off-line to protect my computer and a
guy is outside with a chain-saw jes cutting away, lightening everywhere!!)

Sam: Isn't e-mail a terrific thing?