I ASK FOR PEACE AND WORD
Cultural Radio,
Prerecorded: “Here we start “I Ask for Peace and
Word”, a program produced by “Jalisco’s College,” conducted
by Monica Venegas and Cesar Gilabert.
We will share an hour of analysis and opinion with our guests about current topics
outstanding in
MV – Good morning, thanks for joining us. Today
is Thursday 12 of July and we welcome you to our program, today I want to thank
to…. Dr. Fernando Castro Chavez. Sorry
for the delay but, he has Bachelor’s, Specialty, Master’s, and Ph. D. in
Molecular Biology in Medicine. He is here in
fdocc – Good morning, I am thankful with
you, Monica, Cesar. Also with Gustavo, who already interviewed me …
CG – No, but he doesn’t count, ‘cause he’s from
another program. No, just kidding, look, this idea of the Doctorate in “Molecular
Biology in Medicine”, I am reading the titule of your
degree thesis “Analysis of the Expression of Genes Implicated in Lipid
Metabolism in the Knock-Out Mouse for Perilipin that
is Obesity Resistant”. Tell me in simple words, ¿what is this?
fdocc – Briefly that would be “Which are
the Characteristics of the Mouse that Never Gets Obese”. A mouse that no matter
how many fats or carbohydrates eats, it keeps itself lean.
CG – And, well, being this the Country with the
second place in obesity. This Country has the first place in obese women worldwide…
¿yes? Men and women in
fdocc – Human being could, based on what
we have learned with the characteristics of the mouse, reduce obesity through
reversible inhibition of the gene producing a structural protein. Explained in
simple form, the structural protein is like a box were fats are stored, which
are the ones forming the “belly” and developing obesity.
MV – The so beautiful “belly”…
CG – We don’t know what’s he
talking there...
fdocc – Yes… so (smile), that’s in simple
terms.
CG – Well, and of course, can you tell us what
kina of diseases and other things related with obesity, in order that we can be
able to grasp the problem that we are talking, because, of course, obesity is
becoming a topic, practically, so to say, a public health problem ¿no? Then ¿which
are its implications? …
fdocc – Simply we need to see that about 80 % of obese
persons, sooner or later will develop diabetes, and they have another kind of
problems like heart inflammation and then, all those collateral diseases apart
of productive life reduction and emotional distress, it affects our economy a
lot.
CG – We need to say that the first cause of death
in
fdocc – Certainly, obesity can be controlled.
We are treating obesity with molecular similar than when you use the switch to
stop the light, to dim obesity and
related genes, in order that the person could be able to start losing weight.
CG – So, instead of liposuctions…
MV – I remind you of our phone here… that you
can participate… Fernando Castro Chavez is joining us, and well, and he has
this Ph. D. in Molecular Biology in Medicine and I want, as well as Cesar asked
you, in simple words for you to explain us what is “Molecular Biology”.
fdocc – Yes, Molecular Biology is the study
of the smallest part, basic for life. The part that allows
you to be yourself, biologically. For each person to
exist. It is the study of the function of genes and their structure. The
genes’ function is to produce proteins, chiefly. Then, Molecular Biology also studies
normal proteins, their forms, their characteristics, and when there is a change,
an alteration, to see where is the damage and to try
to fix it.
MV – Genes, in foods, where?
fdocc – Genes in the organism of each
living being. You eat foods, and from there you take the prime matter to produce
your proteins. With what you have ingested, you reorder the molecules and atoms,
to produce useful proteins for you.
CG – And at those sizes really molecular, our structure
is very similar with that of the mouse, for example.
fdocc – Yes, many molecular mechanisms,
processes, have a common pattern. Like when we were talking before of the hand
of the artist, like a painter, my professor Javier Niño,
you can recognize his style when you see his works. You see the works of Botero and you can recognize their style, talking now about
obesity. And in this case also, we can recognize the pattern of a common design
from the smallest organisms, bacteria for example they have molecules, and genes
and atoms with similar functions like the ones that we develop. Of course, with
variations, we are more complex, but you can see a pattern, if we use animals
as model, we can learn, and try to see if the same can work with the human
being.
MV – Which is the scientific process to identify
genes?
fdocc – For example, you have an animal
model, and you see its characteristics. In this case, it was discovered a gene whose
product is a protein that stores fat. Then, a scientist declared: We are going
to see if we inactivate this gene, what happens with the little animal? Then,
deliberately Scientists harm genes and then they find out which changes the animal
experiences. When the perilipin gene was damaged, it
was destroyed this fat storage box, the animal was lacking of fat storage and
constantly was burning fats, and never got obese, no matter how many fats or carbohydrates
were eaten.
MV – Well that’s marvelous.
CG – Well, I take three to go, please … Sandra
Garcia is calling us, he salutes our guest, she sends loads of congratulations
to Doctor Fernando Castro and asks what can she do in order for her daughter to
be able to eat as she is bad to eat? And she says, not only comments on her
daughter, but also she salutes her daughter through this media, what happens, say,
not only with Sandra’s daughter, but with us that have habits very in conflict
with what should be good eating?
fdocc – Yes, the organism has a system to
recognize when he needs to be feed. Then, children are, in a very natural way, their
organism when they are hungry and in which amount. Many times we, adults are
the ones that for social reasons overfeed ourselves and there is when it starts
the “belly” formation. Then in this case, that the mother of this girl don’t
worry, that Mrs. Sandra, thank you for your call, don’t worry, the organism of
the girl is telling her the needs it has and it’ll be possible, if Mom wants to
improve her diet, to control the junk food, that it needs to be reduced, and
that’s the one that generally kids are more attracted, and to try to look the
form to make attractive to her vegetables and fruits.
CG – Good that you mention junk food because it
is a worry for us.
MV – And well, we have another call, this is
from Aime Arias. She felicitates the program also for
bringing this kind of guests, because the “culture” of junk food is very strong,
precisely.
fdocc – Thank you Aime,
her observation is very good, and yes, also it is that once we control obesity,
to educate people, with the proper nutrition and with the proper physical activity.
Because this will be a reversible inhibition, that will be something temporal. In
simple words, we don’t want that the person become an addict to a drug. Will be
drug-dependence because, once it is discovered the reversible substance for
people to keep lean, it will need constantly to ingest that substance. Then, the
person gets lean and not to depend on this medicine that inhibits the protein, that
prevents the fat storage, then the person will need, once she gets lean to
learn to eat better and to do exercise.
MV – To do this, to deactivate say this gene in
which you are doing the study of your thesis, there is not any repercussion?
fdocc – Very good question, thanks that
you mention it, of course. Every human medicine has side effects. The most diluted,
the lesser side effects, but the amount that normally “heals” a symptom, are
high and can have side effects. What may be a side effect of this possible
medicine once it is discovered in humans? Because in humans we can not do what
is done in mice, to deliberately destroy un gen. Rather in humans is like to put
a temporary clip, people gets lean and once that happens, it is removed. Then, the
side effect is that, the person in a cold place, if she has the inhibitor, if
it has the clip not to store fat, what happens is that it lacks its thermoregulation
system. Then yes, there are always side effects. Which means: A person with
this medicine could not stay in cold places, because it will lack of its thermoregulation
system normally working, until the clip is removed, or the inhibitor. Then, the
side effect is that thermoregulation gets reduced. Then, either we stay in a tropical
place, and that’s one of the important reasons why we want to stay here in
MV - Good, I remind you, we are with Doctor
Fernando Castro Chavez. We are talking about Molecular Biology.
(Melody:
Prerecorded: An open tribune for
your voice to be heard. “I Ask for Peace and Word”.
MV – 224-8072 is our phone in “I Ask for Peace
and Word”, we are today with Doctor Fernando Castro Chavez talking about
Molecular Biology and about these interesting processes.
CG – Yes, look, we need to tell in many
aspects, this research of the character that you are presenting to us, has many
applications and one of those has to do with prevention. There is a lot of beds
in the hospital that today are busy with sick people with maladies which they
shouldn’t get sick with and this has to do with several situations, one of
these, well we are talking clearly, if the persons are obese, clearly in another
moment they will have cardiovascular problems or they will have diabetes’
problems. For example, now that there is no this prevention, what happens in the
hospitals? In what the money is expended? Eh, what diseases are appearing?
fdocc – Thanks, very good question… days ago I went
with the sub-director of the IMSS here in Puerto Vallarta, Doctor Alejandro Lopez
and he took me to visit the hospital, and told me that half the expense of the Social
Security here in Puerto Vallarta is for kidney problems. The expense in
dialysis is too big, a person is out one day, and needs to return for two days because
her own kidneys don’t work at all. Then he told me, if we could be able to discover
the way to regenerate kidney, our costs will be reduced because then, instead
of the person depending on an external machine to be able to evacuate the
liquids, we will be stimulating her own organism to regenerate, which means, to
reconstruct the damaged tissue being able to function again by itself.
CG – This regeneration question, has something
to do with this research related with “Stem Cells”?
fdocc – Yes, completely, for example in its
early studies, we can remember things that regenerate, like plants, with a
fragment of a twig, or with a leave you can regenerate the full plant. In animals,
we all have seen that when we take a lizard by the tail, it releases it and the
lizard regenerates a new tail. But there are more extreme animals and those are
from here, from Mexico, the Axolotl or Ambystoma living
in the Lake of Patzcuaro, and other lakes like Zumpango, Zempoala… and these
animals not only regenerate the tail. Those are big amphibians, similar to a
miniature crocodile with fat face, and its four extremities. And the surprising
thing is that if you cut a leg of this animal, it regenerates it. And what
happens is that its cells dedifferentiate and revert to a state that we may call
of pluripotentiality and are capable of producing new
cartilage, bone, skin, nerve (nervous system).
CG – Let’s say in simple words, it will be like
playing cards and having the wild card. The joker card then can shape according
to the needs of the body ¿no?
fdocc – Exactly.
CG – Now, there is a lot of myths I have heard,
specially in literature related to Stem Cells research that are extracted from
human embryos and as a matter of fact. in
fdocc – In
CG – Well, in a general level we can say, adult
metabolism is slower in every aspect of its cellular proliferation, no? Is
useful the research to revert some processes related to aging? Delay them? Or such things?
fdocc – More than anything, in specific
organs, it will be possible to attempt to have a replace system, see? It’s very
surprising that in our organisms the liver, if 2/3 of it were cut, the
remaining third could be able to regenerate another full liver. Then, we, in fact
have an organ very regenerative, the liver. Also the pancreas regenerates but
the liver regenerates faster. Then, if we learn from those organs and see the genes
which are expressing there, we could try to see if it’s possible also to regenerate
something more difficult at these moments such the kidney.
CG – And a question, maybe more trivial but I
am sure that some portion of the public will be interested in: and what’s the
function of the liver? It may be an obvious question but, the liver is one of
the organs more complex of the human body, I’ll identify it as a pharmacy of
the human body. But, what’s the function of the liver? In
simple words …
fdocc – The liver is basic to process every
substance arriving to the organism. Then, foods, fats, carbohydrates, and most especially
toxic products, they end in the liver and the liver tries to destroy them, processing
them to reduce their harm. From there they go to the kidney to be expelled. The
liver is, effectively as you adequately mentioned it, is the laboratory of our
organism. Is the one that directs, and is very interesting the way tissues
cross-talk, the liver communicates with the brain and tells it, I need a bit of
this, a little bit of that, then the brain awakes in the stomach the need to
ingest food, and the brain as well, according to its communication with the
liver, it says when it’s full, when it’s satiated of such need. Then, there is
a very good intercommunication between organs. At the end it’s told to the
muscle: we have enough carbohydrates, now you can use them and the heart as
well.
VM – We have some questions but before of it I
wish you to comment, in
fdocc –
CG – We don’t realize such things here...
fdocc – The ones a little more resistant
are the Caucasian, the European races.
CG – Yes well, simply Russians with Vodka…
climates and…
VM – I hear also the news that medicines were assimilated
differently in the organisms of the different races, true?
fdocc – Exactly, each ethnic group has a different
metabolism. We wish the day in which each medicine be dosed according to the
ethnic group to not affect so much other organs, to prevent a lot of the lateral
effects.
VM – Well, alter this musical pause we will
read your questions. We invite you to continue participating… and we continue listening
“Proyecto Tacos”.
CG – How interesting…
(Music: Entre Amigos,
Café Corregidora. Broken Beat.
[Next Information within Asterisks Rebuilt by
Memory]
* MV – Well, this was “Proyecto
Tacos”. We salute Willow Brizio here from the show.
CG – In the musical pause we asked Doctor
Fernando Castro: How it is that you landed in
fdocc – Well. My parents live here. When
my father retired, some five years ago, they decided to come to live here. I
thank my dad Manuel Castro, who helped me to obtain my Doctor’s degree. I came
to
CG – Here, I have a special call. This is from
your cousin Aida de la Torre Castro,
he greets you and says that the talk is very interesting, what do you tell us
about this call?
fdocc – Yes, I thank my cousin Aida for her
call and her husband, my cousin Gustavo. They are here on vacations from
CG – Are they from the same place you did your
research?
fdocc – No, I was in
VM – Aurora Leon felicitates the speaker and
says that she has hypotiroydism. She asks, if a medicine able to counter obesity is found, does the
person have to take it for life?
fdocc – No, we hope to be able to find this antidote
and that the person be able to take it until she reaches their proper weight, one
that is reached, to leave the medicine in order that * again she will be able
to work with exercise, and nutrition to reach the point when she don’t depend on
the medicament.
VM – You told us that this research in simple
words is like putting a clip to the gene to silence it and after that to take
it out.
fdocc – Yes.
VM – My question is this one: is there any possibility
that this altering, repeatedly for a long time, be hereditary, that this gene be
transmuted into another gene and to have some kind of problems?
fdocc – Not, it wont be inheritable. But
the person will be depending on an external substance to be able to inhibit it.
CG – And also we need to tell that the dependence
not only may be physiological, but psychological and there it can be devastating,
then, if there is not an educational strategy to change habits, well this and
any other medicine may generate some phantoms in the mind, or not? Collateral
damages not precisely implied with physiology.
fdocc – Apart of the possible cost. It always
deals with lowering the costs as possible, but the moment will come in which it
will be told to a person: Look, this can help you, but once you reach your
proper weight we are going to try for you not to depend on this substance.
MV – In comparing other current treatments, in this
sense to reduce hunger, the appetite, versus the appetite suppressors, what advantages
does it have?
fdocc – Commercial substances available
now act at the neuronal level, at the level of the brain. They suppress some
nervous receptors in the brain the ones that tell you, “I hunger, I want to eat”.
They suppress them, but in this case it will be to suppress the function of a
structural protein, of a mechanical protein. The advantage is that it won’t act
on the nervous system, and the collateral effects will be very small because
every substance that is acting on receptor systems of the brain, neuronal, could
have collateral effects like some depression, or some emotional things not so
clear. And when it acts at a mechanical level, like in this case, this mouse, at
the same time that increases the fatty acids burning, as all the genes of beta
oxidation are activated, and the Krebs cycle, and the respiratory chain, and at
the same time, the expression of all genes involved in fat synthesis in the
animal are reduced. Which means that is totally balanced.
CG – In conduct terms, is it more active? Is it
more resistant to fatigue? Does it improve other capacities, concentration for
example, attention? What happens?
fdocc – There is something, that this
animal have more muscles. Which means, when they weight this animal that never
gets obese and compare it with the wild type animal, they practically have the
same weight, the difference is that this animal, what it lacks in stored fat,
it has developed in muscle.
CG – Hey, will this little animal pass the anti-doping
in sports? To participate …
fdocc – No, I think…
CG – What I mean seems like a joke, but it will
be part sports medicine, the possibility to experiment with these or from the
start they won’t pass the anti-doping test.
fdocc – Sports medicine doesn’t want the person
to be dependent, because any external substance to the nature of the sportsman,
sooner or later will be put aside. Even when wont be a drug in the sense of hallucinating,
is an external substance to be restricted.
MV –
(Song: Wixarika +pa Mituchi. Broken Beat.
Prerecorded: Participate directly in our
debates. Communicate by phone to …
MV – Thanks to be with us, we have here our
last segment. There is a lot to say but we will try to be brief in our comments,
to continue reading your phone calls. We were talking in this space while we
were listening the music of the benefits of biological resources in Mexico, why
they favour us, and among other things the climate and
specifically, well we were laughing that the Doctor was telling us about the
favorable that is this that we are suffering here in Puerto Vallarta.
fdocc – I absolutely think that even when there is uncomfortable,
I we see the sunny side of the heat situation we will see that even to sweat is
beneficial for your organism because you eliminate every great amount of toxics,
that otherwise will be left stored and for example, in cold places where there
is no stimulation to eliminate through sweat these toxins, they stay on the
skin, they remain stored and all this can contribute with diseases, cancer problems
and all of that. Then, it has its advantages even the sweat to eliminate toxics.
CG – Let’s see, can you tell me what toxins do
in the body?
fdocc – Yes, toxins are something strange
to the organism, something that the organism cannot, many times cannot even to process.
Then, what the body does with some chemical toxins for example, is to try to
surround them with cells and then there is when it starts to accumulate a cell
mass that can end up with cancer. Then, for me that many toxins that we ingest from
the foods or that enter from the environment stay stored and the organism, when
cannot eliminate them, surrounds them and can be one of the ways in which cancers
develop, and the idea will be then to stimulate the form in which the person herself
could be able to eliminate it. And there is where sweat is very good, then, there
are many things that we have here in
MV – Well, this project that you presented here
in Guadalajara University, related to the mouse that don’t gets obese to say it
in few words, but the purpose is to do also another kind of research?
fdocc – Yes, once we start in
MV – And well, to go with something to think I wish
you to explain us, how important are the genes?
fdocc – Yes, genes are the basis of life because
form there, from genes you obtain proteins. First it was thought that a gene was
able to produce only one protein, but now as it is investigated, it has been
seen that one gene can produce multiple proteins. For example, we have approximately
35,000 genes in human, but we have more than a million proteins. Then, it means
that with one gene, according to the variants in the re-coupling, in the “splicing”, which is like a readjustment,
a cut and paste. With one gene divided in nine segments, for example, that are
called exons, some variants will take only eight of
those nine segments and will give a different protein when compared if seven of
those segments were taken. Which means that one gene can produce multiple proteins
and these are the basis of your metabolism and your biological well being.
MV – Do we have a last question?
CG – Yes, well more than a question, Pedro Ruiz
felicitates the guests. Well, Doctor Fernando Castro. He says that these contributions
benefit us all and humanity in general, that a very good program. Well, we
finally reach the end of the program. We have a couple of minutes.
MV – And yes, well, I want to thank the Doctor,
for joining us today. I repeat that it has been of great interest what he has
presented to us in this program, in Gustavo’s program as well. As a matter of
fact he already received an invitation on the part of here, Cultural Radio to
frequently participate. All of that will depend on how these projects be programmed, but independently, you are invited again to
another program, there are many things that we still can comment on it. But, thanks
for having been with us.
fdocc – I am thankful with you. And if I
am accepted in the University, well I wish also to invite each of the students to
contribute with their studies and what they’ll be learning.
MV – And we invite the audience to be with us
the next program, Thursday next week at the same time. My name is Monica Venegas.
CG – In controls it was “Hazard”, I am Cesar Gilabert and this was another edition of “I Ask for Peace
and Word”.
fdocc – Thanks very much and have a good
day.
(The next program is advertised: “Restaurant
Trio Coffee Bar”)
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