SS100888 he he vel

Gwynhyvar nah.....just takes a eureka moment

Ygraine_ I'm useless at riddles

velvt. SS, i don't mind snow, but i sure wish it would have come in 3 or 4 inch bursts, not all at once

Gwynhyvar you know exactly what it is, you just can`t it off the tip of your tongue

0_sugar_0 hehe, a GE lightbulb moment.....to bad Im only working with a 40 watt bulb...lol

SS100888 no doubt vel

Gwynhyvar LOL

SS100888 btw please call me Sandy that is my name

SS100888 SS sounds so.......

Gwynhyvar brb

SS100888 official lol

velvt. yeah, i know, but i go mindless and just type what's in front of me ... sorry

0_sugar_0 hehe,keep reminding me sandy, I will eventually remember, think it only took me a month of daily reminders from sean before I was able to remember to call him that

SS100888 he he

SS100888 lol

SS100888 I haven't had time to check in with you all

SS100888 but imagine you have all had fun lol

velvt. has bettypagelover been in today?

SS100888 no idea vel

SS100888 just got here myself

0_sugar_0 dont know velvt, just got here myself right before you did

velvt. ty

SS100888 yw

SS100888 most welcome

SS100888 hey num............

velvt. i am really out of it LOL... sitting here feeling like my brain has gone numb, the way a foot does

velvt. ygraine, what did you want our comments on before?

Ygraine_ ok, can I ask my question now?

velvt. :)

SS100888 Can I have some of those drugs lol

0_sugar_0 hehe, have to do like I do when my foot goes to sleep....just bang your head on the floor real hard till you feel pins and needles...lol

albertjaquaya ask yg

0_sugar_0 go for it Ygraine

SS100888 <<<<<<<-------- getting al the step ladder for a pulpit lol

Ygraine_ I had a lady come to see me today, she had a year of misdiagnose breast cancer and now she has convinced herself that she will die shortly

0_sugar_0 whoa, heavy duty stuff Ygraine

SS100888 mammographer y?

Ygraine_ She asked me if I thought she could get justice...and I didn't know how to answer her

SS100888 you told her the truth

Ygraine_ so I'm asking you the question...is there justice?

albertjaquaya maybe she wants to sue?

Ygraine_ No Sandy, I help people who have complaints against the health service

SS100888 yep its called Shapiro Shapiro, and Shapiro lol

0_sugar_0 I dont know that she can insist on justice in her way or the way she wants it to happen, it rarely happens that way, but justice seems to happen, in its own time

SS100888 oh wow, y that is tuff

Gwynhyvar back

0_sugar_0 wb

SS100888 tell her to get a good lawyer if she wishes to pursue it

Ygraine_ I only get heavy duty stuff (smile)

Gwynhyvar ty :-)

velvt. in this case, justice is karmic, i think. but even so, i think whoever mishandled her case should be held accountable. BUT, that said, will it really help her now? or should she focus on attitude?

Ygraine_ she has to go through the complaints system before she can go to a lawyer

SS100888 amen vel

SS100888 do you think its a valid complaint?

SS100888 if so, then you need to grant it

SS100888 Hiya red!!!!!!!

Ygraine_ I suspect there will be answers that may not be simple

Ygraine_ Greetings Redeemed

albertjaquaya hi red

0_sugar_0 I would try to find out if this is a pattern of misdiagnosis from a particular doctor, and if so, I would definately try to see they arent allowed to practice anymore

--Redeemed-- HELLO SS,,,hope you are having a good day,,,!!!!

Gwynhyvar Allo Redeemed :-) How are you my friend?

0_sugar_0 Hi Red

Ygraine_ They did 2 needle biopsies and then sent her away for a year saying it was ok

--Redeemed-- Y,,,hope you are having a good one too,,,

velvt. Y, if it is your responsibility to sort of prescreen them, i'd find out how closely she went along with her doctor's orders, tests, follow ups, etc.

0_sugar_0 sometimes its not a matter of the doctor misdiagnosing illness but shoddy lab work

SS100888 and contamination

0_sugar_0 there was a news magazine show about labs that repeatedly missed stuff because they were pushing for maximum production rather than taking their time on each slide

Ygraine_ I don't prescreen, my role is just to assist through the process...but I give advice and I've got 12 years experience in this field

velvt. if she did as instructed by the medical practitioners, then i think she is justified in seeking redress

EternumPace>>>) greetings, Redeemed

velvt. but still, that is a negative energy undertaking, and it may harm her more than help her

SS100888 so thankful I am not a dr

SS100888 lol

Ygraine_ but putting aside the individual case....can anyone think about what justice is?

--Redeemed-- Gwyn,,,hope your day is going well friend,,

Ygraine_ Yes, I know Velvt and she;s in terrible shock at the moment

SS100888 for misdiagnosis someone shoule be held accountable

Gwynhyvar *warm smile*...It could be better, but then again it isn`t over yet :-)

0_sugar_0 if she undertakes it with the attitude of helping others, keeping a bad doctor out of buisiness, or shutting down a bad lab, so other wont be harmed that at least is a positive thing

--Redeemed-- hello EternumPace>>>),,,best to you today

0_sugar_0 but to do it for vengence or the sake of anger, that can cause as much harm as good

EternumPace>>>) justice is not so much one thing, but what things are

Ygraine_ I agree, Sugar...and that's what she says she wants

velvt. justice is a terribly slippery concept, IMO

0_sugar_0 justice takes as many forms as injustice does, what is justice to one is injustice to another

Ygraine_ eternum..could you expand on that concept a little more please?

velvt. Y, what do her doctors tell her now? is she terminal?

--Redeemed-- true justice ....can only come through JESUS CHRIST,,!!!

SS100888 yes red its true

velvt. thank you red... predictable comment, but welcome all the same :)

0_sugar_0 lol

SS100888 lol vel

Ygraine_ I don't know, Velvt, she's refused chemo and is going to have radiotherapy once the scar has healed

--Redeemed-- VEL,,,ARE YOU SAYING IM PREDICTABLE..???....LOL...

0_sugar_0 Ive heard chemo is often worse than the disease

velvt. i know that justice is NOT revenge, although the two are often confused

SS100888 he he red

0_sugar_0 agreed velvt

0_sugar_0 justice is not based on hate or fear

velvt. yeah, red, a tad predictable :)

--Redeemed-- vel,,,hope that is good,,!!!

SS100888 I know that my Redeemer lives

velvt. hmmm.... depends on one's perspective, i guess, red

--Redeemed-- ss,,,amen and amen..!!!!

albertjaquaya if you dont have a beleif system as in a god the sue get revenge after all thats all you have left

--Redeemed-- vel,,,and how do you feel about that,,??

Ygraine_ Red, she's probably either 7th day adventist or Pentacostal, so she would be working within that belief system

albertjaquaya brb

velvt. in this case, red, i think it was rather useless information... means little in the circumstances. how can Y's client benefit from what you said, really?

0_sugar_0 seems that the word justice and punishment are often synonimous to most folks

SS100888 yep

--Redeemed-- vel,,,just trust JESUS,,,very simple,,!!!

0_sugar_0 justice is about equality, fairness, truth, punishment is about another thing altogether

--Redeemed-- vel,,,HE knows all about it,,,HE is just waiting to be asked,,!!

Ygraine_ yes and if we wait for Jesus to zap the lab or the hospital we might be waiting a long time

0_sugar_0 Hi xyz

albertjaquaya back

0_sugar_0 wb

albertjaquaya ty

SS100888 getting coffee again al?

albertjaquaya yep

velvt. justice... i have let go of seeking it, in my life. i have to live in faith that justice will come in the karmic balancing of things, people, events

0_sugar_0 I had coffee with the lady I clean for today, we got a chance to visit...she told a story about karma and how it can work....

SS100888 ya know that coffee is against the word of wisdom

SS100888 tsk! tsk!

0_sugar_0 it was a very interesting and telling story of how a persons greed and avarice can backfire on them

velvt. however, in specific circumstances, i do what i can to see that i receive justice and act in a just manner with others

albertjaquaya ah you can use both and attain wisdom

Ygraine_ listening Sugar

SS100888 I don't drink coffee al

albertjaquaya okay

0_sugar_0 there ya go, its about intent velvt, to seek justice for the sake of justice and not revenge

SS100888 Do I look like a mug???

albertjaquaya iam

albertjaquaya lol

SS100888 i know it

0_sugar_0 oh...hehe, well, she worked for a guy, a co-president of company

SS100888 lol

0_sugar_0 the other co-president was a greedy guy, bossy, snotty, thought he could run the company better by himself

SS100888 sounds like my ex lol

0_sugar_0 he tried to fire her, (she was the secretary for the nicer fellow)

0_sugar_0 and she told him he couldnt fire her, as she was not hired by him

EternumPace>>>) and, yet, do we have an intention for being intentional, and how do we gain understanding of it without a biological solipsism

SS100888 key word Snotty lol

0_sugar_0 she stuck around for another year, while the not so nice boss rifled thru the other fellows files, paperwork etc

SS100888 thank god I have tissues lol

Ygraine_ solipsism?

SS100888 no nose picking here invovled lol

0_sugar_0 looking for any edge to put him on top....eventually she quit, and her boss quit too....

albertjaquaya spiritual is your answer i think

0_sugar_0 the snotty guy/boss, got control of the company...and 6 months later found he had stomach cancer

EternumPace>>>) the scientific method should include the dictum: self is the measure of all things

albertjaquaya lol

0_sugar_0 talk about karma coming back to bite you

albertjaquaya science again

SS100888 to change the subject

0_sugar_0 science and spirituality are not incompatable albert

0_sugar_0 they often can and do support eachother if viewed with an open and accepting mind

albertjaquaya it is for alot of people sugar

SS100888 nose picking is not an acquired art form

0_sugar_0 its all in how they choose to view them albert

Gwynhyvar it's not??.........whoops

velvt. those people are ignorant then, albert

albertjaquaya i accepy science also

SS100888 my stff. sargeant daily picks his nose

albertjaquaya but science dosnt have all the answers

SS100888 and guess what??????

SS100888 he eats it..........

velvt. oh gag

SS100888 eew!!!!!!!!!

Gwynhyvar umm....EEEkkk

0_sugar_0 what is a mystery albert...something that is not known, but is not un-knowable

Ygraine_ Sandy, I don't think I needed to know that

SS100888 waiting for him to share with me

0_sugar_0 brb, phone

SS100888 at which point I will hurl lol

velvt. men ! feh ! they're just gross !

SS100888 so gross

SS100888 hey vel

SS100888 the best is when the hawk and spit outta a moving car

SS100888 gag!!!!!!

SS100888 or pass wind and blame it on you lol

albertjaquaya lol

velvt. i had a bf, we were on a long road trip, and he got into doing that, to some obsessive fault. it was my car, and his crud was all over the side of it so i demanded he clean it.

velvt. he just could NOT understand why i insisted

--Redeemed-- question.....why do men and women have such a hard time understanding each other,,????

SS100888 ew!!!!!!!

SS100888 tis easy red

SS100888 Men are PIGS lol

SS100888 oink oink

albertjaquaya lol

--Redeemed-- ss...im a man,,

Gwynhyvar (All men are animals. Some just make better Pets...)

Ygraine_ Not all of them, Sandy, you obvioulsy haven't come across any gentlemen

velvt. red, i have an answer but i'm not sure men would find it acceptable

SS100888 I know that

SS100888 do you spit outta moving vehicles

SS100888 do you pick your nose and eat it?

--Redeemed-- ss,,,no

albertjaquaya lol

--Redeemed-- ss...no

SS100888 do you fart and blame it on someone else?

velvt. do you tell constant fart jokes?

albertjaquaya lol

SS100888 lol vel

--Redeemed-- no...i take the blame,,,lol

SS100888 good man then!!!!!!!!

albertjaquaya iam innocent of all that

--Redeemed-- ss,,,no

SS100888 1 in a million I'd say

Ygraine_ Hi Flower

SS100888 the best is

EternumPace>>>) i heard that doctors proved through some study that kissing was biologically reminiscent of butt licking/sniffing

albertjaquaya hi flo

-Flower-Time- Guten Morgen alles

--Redeemed-- ss,,,JESUS helped me to be a better man than i was,,!!!

albertjaquaya same here red

SS100888 when your spouse lets his wind be free and he pulls the covers over your head

SS100888 so everyone can enjoy it

SS100888 sorry

velvt. as far as the difference goes, men tend to be left brain oriented... logical, linear, etc. they filter out most other functioning from their awareness.

0_sugar_0 lol, Im back, that was one of hubby's fellow truck drivers, a native to east texas, he's freaking out over the weather conditions

SS100888 vel that and every morning they gotta go pee (get my drift ) lol

velvt. women, on the other hand, are more evenly balanced between right and left brains... the two halves have access to each other.

--Redeemed-- question,,,why do you think GOD created us so different,,??

-Flower-Time- Wie geht es Ihnen?

0_sugar_0 men tend to be linear thinkers, women tend to be circular thinkers, they arent incompatable just different ways of viewing and approaching things

albertjaquaya to mate?

Ygraine_ Mir geht's gut, danke, Flower

SS100888 mate????

Gwynhyvar Red.....go look up Darwin and his theory of natural selection

EternumPace>>>) i also heard of a study that supports the different brain structure of men and women, in such study, only women had elevated activity in reasoning centre during pain and/or shock

SS100888 what now we are dogs lol

velvt. so a woman CAN understand a man, but a man cannot understand the consciousness of a woman

SS100888 AMEN

0_sugar_0 there are many examples of polarity in the world around us Red, male and female, right and left brain ways of thinking etc

albertjaquaya to bring into the world people capable of attaining truth ss

-Flower-Time- Bitteschon Ygraine

--Redeemed-- my wife and i get along all the time,,,is that abnormal,,??

albertjaquaya no

albertjaquaya same here

0_sugar_0 another science factoid eternum...women in general have a much higher pain tolerance then men do, on the average

EternumPace>>>) men are a kind of woman are they not

velvt. yes, eternum... a female is the template

-Flower-Time- thats why men cant have babies.....they couldnt deal with the pain

EternumPace>>>) yes, i have heard of that, sugar. i believe it

-Flower-Time- lol

velvt. biologically

albertjaquaya you must have what i have red

--Redeemed-- we get along so good because JESUS lives in our hearts,,!!!can anyone understand that,,??

albertjaquaya its great

0_sugar_0 males have many feminine attributes as well as women having male attributes also, to their personality and characters

EternumPace>>>) well, flower, the reasoning could equally go, men cannot endure as much pain Because they do not birth

Ygraine_ Redeemed, so do my husband and I

empty-mind hello room

--Redeemed-- glad to hear that al,,,!!!!

SS100888 men are lovely creatures (I suppose)

velvt. hi empty

0_sugar_0 not to mention the hormone factors...lol, males have some estrogen, females progesterone and testosterone too

SS100888 women are lovely creatures lol

albertjaquaya yes red you are correct once again

SS100888 hey vel...

SS100888 you seen meatcutter lately?

velvt. SS, speaking of that.... blue was in here lately... how did you two get along after i left the other night?

-Flower-Time- Ygraine, are you fluent in german?

velvt. meatcutter?

0_sugar_0 brb

SS100888 haven't seen him

SS100888 blue I mean

Ygraine_ nein, einmal ein bistschen

albertjaquaya red talks spiritual those not spiritual find you and me red hard to understand

velvt. he wondered if you had been around, SS

SS100888 1st time here since Thursday

albertjaquaya as fortold red

-Flower-Time- lol, cool

EternumPace>>>) man "appears" to be a piece of a woman

Ygraine_ Hi empty

SS100888 just been working

SS100888 and sleepingt

empty-mind hi ygraine

--Redeemed-- al,,,for sure,,!!!!

-Flower-Time- Ich spreche nur ein bisschen

albertjaquaya amenred

SS100888 nine

velvt. get a life, albert... you two talk christian... that is not the synonym for spiritual, nor the defining element

Gwynhyvar *point for vel*

albertjaquaya german flo?

--Redeemed-- vel,,,how do you know that,,??

-Flower-Time- Ja Albert

velvt. christian talk is very easy to understand

EternumPace>>>) if we could create a woman and a man, how would we do so and why?

albertjaquaya danka

albertjaquaya lol

SS100888 vel would that be jibberish lol

velvt. redeemed, because the farther away from christianity i get, the more spirituality and divine love i find

Ygraine_ Es war uber dreizig jahre wann ich war in der Schule und habe deutch gelernt

-Flower-Time- aber ich spreche nur ein bißchen. im still learning

SS100888 I am impressed Y

Gwynhyvar tu as dit quoi??

EternumPace>>>) men and womeen ARE cultural creations, lets not kid ourselves

empty-mind velvt... is it because you are farther from Christianity or closer to something else?

--Redeemed-- vel,,,spirituality comes in two directions,,,,heaven and hell...

SS100888 vels going to heaven

EternumPace>>>) not now, not after we have come so far together :)

SS100888 I know that

albertjaquaya amen red

albertjaquaya well said

-Flower-Time- High school Yg?

velvt. closer to god, empty, once i was able to shake off the dogma and experience divine love more directly

empty-mind understood

SS100888 I have such issues with "born again"

Gwynhyvar oh christ.......if somehow the fundies are right, I`m going to hell.........could I at least make a pit stop for coffee on the way?

SS100888 the authority and the right to speak for all christians

--Redeemed-- vel,,,closer to god,,,which god is that,,??

Ygraine_ que c'est trente annee que j'ai apris le deutch dans ma lycee Gwyn

velvt. well, red, don't lose your cool when you get to heaven and see me there to greet you

EternumPace>>>) "the mind is its own place and can make a hell out of heaven, a heaven out of hell"

empty-mind I feel there are some who find that (but not many) within all faiths including Chistianity

Gwynhyvar some people just can`t survive without Timmie's

Gwynhyvar ahhh...bon

Gwynhyvar brb

velvt. yes empty, i agree, but some paths make it so much harder

SS100888 not that many would be the key word

--Redeemed-- vel,,,i will be so glad to see you there,,!!!

SS100888 I know what I believe

empty-mind some paths go in contrary directions, no doubt

velvt. red, i thought we agreed there is only one god? IMO that god can manifest in many ways, depending on our needs

SS100888 and I am so ;happy with my beliefs

empty-mind that or only one goddess

SS100888 but I don't shove it SHOVE it down someone elses throat

velvt. that's great, SS... i know that all seekers find the path best for them

-Flower-Time- Das wetter hier ist sehr schön.

SS100888 amen vel

Ygraine_ Nicht hier!

velvt. empty, to me god is a generic term, no gender, but the manifestations can be male or female if that works best

SS100888 Ya know I gotta love you

SS100888 you are a kind and thoughtful person

-Flower-Time- Es ist kalt hier

velvt. thank you sandy

SS100888 yr, and I know this is true

Gwynhyvar *sigh*........I`ll be back in 5......kids opened up the fridge door and it broke off......<seriously>

-Flower-Time- schnei (sp)

velvt. i aim for it, sandy, but i fail a lot

EternumPace>>>) velvt, have you ever considered that not-man and not-woman also leaves one other gender open for your consideration?

SS100888 oh my......

Ygraine_ good luck, Gwyn

velvt. oh geesh, gwyn !

Gwynhyvar I have a feeling I may need it Y

velvt. no i haven't etern... what is that?

SS100888 guess thats one more thing we have in common.....

Gwynhyvar *sigh*..........duct tape...........LOL....brb

albertjaquaya maybe bolts came loose

SS100888 vel we are human beings

EternumPace>>>) perhaps, Androgyne, velvt.

Ygraine_ a third gender>

velvt. yep, definitely human here LOL

SS100888 lol

empty-mind Hmmm etern... sounds like maybe you like the term "berdache"? works for me.

EternumPace>>>) what is "berdache"?

-Flower-Time- Woher sind Sie Yg?

SS100888 it is pitch black here

Ygraine_ England, Flower

SS100888 just reflection from snow

empty-mind third gender, containing both male and female spirits in balance

-Flower-Time- cool

velvt. etern... my knowingness is that god has no body, thus no genitalia, no hormones, etc... so no gender or even a mix of genders. god is ALL, not a combination of anything

EternumPace>>>) i have never heard that word, empty. what language is that?

-Flower-Time- i was there last year

empty-mind not necessarily gay... can be hetero, just having personality traits of male and female in balance

Ygraine_ I've not heard that one,empty

empty-mind native american

SS100888 pronounced mptee

SS100888 lol

EternumPace>>>) that sounds a tad limiting to me, velvt. But, then, I have a body.

SS100888 Hi anika

velvt. how can being ALL be limiting?

Anika_Jada here comes the sun

Anika_Jada hi ss

Ygraine_ Hi Anika

Anika_Jada hi ygraine

SS100888 its alright

SS100888 lol

Anika_Jada didn't expect to see you two again

EternumPace>>>) i don't rightly know, velvt. I just mean it would be limiting if ALL had a body

SS100888 who 2?

Anika_Jada you an ygraine

EternumPace>>>) because they all would be forever separate from itself

velvt. yes, eternum, that would be a mess, i think LOL

Ygraine_ why Anika?

SS100888 I am here

SS100888 and so is y

Anika_Jada 'cause i never see you

SS100888 don't know y

SS100888 lol;

EternumPace>>>) native american. interesting,,,BERDACHE

Ygraine_ Sometimes I go and write with Sean if he's free, Anika, and sometimes I visit elsewhere

EternumPace>>>) I like learning new words

SS100888 that is good et

EternumPace>>>) empty, does that word, Berdeche, have a cultural context particular to native americans?

velvt. i need to go... take a shower while i have some oomph left in me today

empty-mind There is a similar term I can't remember from traditional Vedic culture which also counted three genders

SS100888 I try to stay away from Pends realm

Ygraine_ take care, Velvt

-Flower-Time- how about shashoo......theres a new word

SS100888 bye vel hun

empty-mind see velvt peace

SS100888 ((((((((((((((((hugs)))))))))))))))))))

EternumPace>>>) goodbye, velvt

velvt. SS, before i go, why do you stay away from the realm?

--Redeemed-- vel ,,,have a good shower,,,dont get wet,,,lol,,,!!

SS100888 people are 2 touchy

velvt. lol red... i'll get wet, but hopefully stay warm

SS100888 from where you land

SS100888 to who speaks to you

SS100888 I don't need the headgames

Ygraine_ ever thought it might be you, Sandy?

SS100888 nope

SS100888 I am not playing headgames

SS100888 I am just me

Ygraine_ nor are they

velvt. SS, for me, many of them are wonderful people, but like all groups, there are differences. several don't like me at all, so to avoid conflicts, i stay away from the group, now, but i interact here freely

SS100888 I was accused of trying to take someones man away

SS100888 not true

EternumPace>>>) we are political animals aren't we

SS100888 I guess so

albertjaquaya thats life

velvt. that's what caused some of my problems with them, sandy... one in particular who then worked to get others on her side

empty-mind life is political, if you live it

-Flower-Time- if you can take someones "man" away on a computer hes not worth taking

SS100888 doesn't mean I dislike people

albertjaquaya good flo

SS100888 or wish them the very best, which I do

EternumPace>>>) that seems true, empty

SS100888 I am not getting caught in the middle

SS100888 works for me lol

empty-mind not necessarily a bad thing, being political

Anika_Jada oh ygraine, that was me i was talking about the other day.. of course..

empty-mind You just have to be willing to stand behind what you say and do

-Flower-Time- i hate politics....gets you nothing but trouble

velvt. empty, there is a book called 'the politics of experience' by r. d. laing.... it's rather old now but you might like it. it turned my life around in HUGE ways

albertjaquaya spiritual takes all my time up

Anika_Jada not that it makes any difference

EternumPace>>>) empty, that word has perked my interes lately. i think of Egypt and Christianity with their shared belief that there is a metaphysical power politics of place

Ygraine_ I thought it might have been Anika, but I thought you would tell us, if you wished it

empty-mind I should check it out. ty

Anika_Jada yeah it was rather obvious

Ygraine_ not to me, Anika, you could have had a client, just as I have client

Ygraine_ s

Anika_Jada hm ok

Ygraine_ power politics of place?

velvt. anyway, off to the showers for me... take care all, walk in the peace and joy of god (||~ Baraka Bashad ~||~ May the Blessings Be ~||)

zonkieone2 sounds good

SS100888 have fun vel

SS100888 make hubby go with lol

Ygraine_ blessings Velvt

EternumPace>>>) i am being a touch nebulous, Ygraine, but only because I want to explore the possibility that the imagination is a place unto itself with its own politics

albertjaquaya are you a "trustee" of sorts yg?

empty-mind strong thought these days, from Egypt or anywhere, that politics is divinely ordained

SS100888 2 in the shower is more fun than 1 lol

zonkieone2 empty mind.....is that true?

empty-mind I don't think it is, but many do

EternumPace>>>) yes, empty, i think of something i recently read in joseph campbells "the masks of god: occidental mythology"

SS100888 he he empty

Ygraine_ I used to be a Trustee of a voluntary mental health organisation, Al, but I don't know if you mean the same kind of trustee

zonkieone2 then why call your self that if you dont believe it

albertjaquaya do you feel responsible for your clients?

EternumPace>>>) to paraphrase, religion without a land, by design or happenstance, is always destructive

SS100888 guess I better sit up............ way over my head lol

empty-mind it is a goal in my life to be empty-minded

zonkieone2 EternumPace>>>)..i agree

empty-mind strikingly similar to actually having something there that matters

zonkieone2 empty.... what kind of goal is that

empty-mind Buddhist

Ygraine_ I do my best for them, Al, I am not responsible for them they are responsible for themselves, they are generally adults

zonkieone2 ahhhhh.....you mean peaceful mind then

empty-mind dhyana

SS100888 I love life!!!!!!!!

Gwynhyvar back

Ygraine_ You can use imagination to make something become real

albertjaquaya do you talk spiritual or religious beleifs or play the corporate way?

empty-mind that and it means I had way to much fun in the 70's

SS100888 call me stupid

EternumPace>>>) einstein once said something along the lines of "if an cluttered desk is the sign of a cluttered mind, what does an empty desk signify?"

empty-mind lol

SS100888 al, what religion are you?

Ygraine_ wb Gwyn..did you manage to fix it?

SS100888 exact;y?????

zonkieone2 empty..me too..late 60's and 70's

albertjaquaya christian ss

EternumPace>>>) Ygraine, what if imagination is a gateway to the real, with its own rites of initiation?

SS100888 how many branches..........

empty-mind eistein also said that the main difference between genius and stupidity was that genius had limits

SS100888 evangelical, methodist, catholic which????

Gwynhyvar I made a bold attempt.....got the "man of the house" to finish it

albertjaquaya "his"

zonkieone2 and i agree with him

Ygraine_ it could very well be....because if your imagination expands, so to the possibilities of reality

empty-mind understood

zonkieone2 who am i not to

EternumPace>>>) thats a good quote, empty

SS100888 I am christian 2

empty-mind It's a fun one

EternumPace>>>) esp. considering what happened to einstein

SS100888 at least I am honest about what church I belong to

zonkieone2 genius and madness are two sides of the same coin

Ygraine_ true

Ygraine_ but then true genius always has a price to pay

EternumPace>>>) we are all utterly mad

SS100888 no answer as usual

zonkieone2 i agree with both of you

EternumPace>>>) didn't jack kerouac say how much he loved the mad ones, the ones that never utter a boring word

zonkieone2 and yes we are all mad to a degree

albertjaquaya we are mad if we think will have power on our own

zonkieone2 i love jack kerouac

--Redeemed-- SS...question,,,,can men and women in mormonism both become gods,,???

EternumPace>>>) that is so true, albert

albertjaquaya ty

Ygraine_ who's jack kerouac?

SS100888 we don't believe in gods....

EternumPace>>>) jack kerouac wrote a popular book called "On The Road"

SS100888 we believe in Jesus Christ and Heavenly Father

SS100888 thats it

EternumPace>>>) a friend of Ken Kesey

Ygraine_ don't know him either

SS100888 god ship doesn't exist

EternumPace>>>) american beat writers, Ygraine

zonkieone2 ken kesey of cookooooooos nest fame...just died....

EternumPace>>>) yeah, zonk :( rest in peace,

zonkieone2 so sad

SS100888 poor albert

Ygraine_ oh, him...yes I know Cuckoo's nest, been to the hospital where that was filmed

albertjaquaya only the children who become kings in the after life

empty-mind Time to go get my daughter at her dance class... the Dad taxi back in action. Peace all.

SS100888 with his bibical quotes can't answer a ?

zonkieone2 peace

Ygraine_ bye Empty. blessings

EternumPace>>>) really, Ygraine, that musthave been weird.

SS100888 bye Y

albertjaquaya be well empty

zonkieone2 by

SS100888 have a nice night

EternumPace>>>) be empty

SS100888 sorry y

SS100888 noticed it wasn't you leaving

Ygraine_ It was, eternum, they showed me around the wards..were so proud of the new colour schemes....pink and blue...designed to induce violence!

albertjaquaya why call me poor albert ss?

--Redeemed-- ss,,,are there different denominations in mormonism..??

SS100888 still waiting all

zonkieone2 waiting for what

SS100888 there is the chruch of jesus christ of latter day saints

SS100888 and the reorganized chruch

zonkieone2 do you bellieve

zonkieone2 in the church of the latter day saints'

albertjaquaya ah jesus in americas

SS100888 why di you ask?

Ygraine_ It was the first place I'd ever been frisked for weapons!!

EternumPace>>>) there is as much truth to any religion has human history

zonkieone2 Just curious

albertjaquaya joe smith

SS100888 jerry falwell

zonkieone2 weapons..in church?

zonkieone2 i would be afraid i would be struck dead

SS100888 jim bakker

Ygraine_ no, Zonkie, Salem Mental Hospital in Oregon

albertjaquaya ss if you are a christian you scare me

SS100888 billy graham

Gwynhyvar Jerry Falwell.......there`s a lawsuit just waiting to happen

albertjaquaya lol

zonkieone2 OOOHHHHH.oopppsss

SS100888 jimmy swaggart

zonkieone2 lol

SS100888 and on and on and on

EternumPace>>>) the Osmanns

Ygraine_ Myst!!

MystHuntr MM and greetings all

SS100888 its spelt Osmond

MystHuntr hey there Ygraine

Gwynhyvar Allo Myst *kisses cheek*

albertjaquaya hi myst

EternumPace>>>) sorry. Osmonds

zonkieone2 greetings

MystHuntr Allo Gwyn

MystHuntr hi Albert

SS100888 they are one family out of 26 milion members

zonkieone2 wow

SS100888 how about Larry King and his wife?

zonkieone2 they are mormons::::: no way

albertjaquaya did they ever find the "plates " ss?

SS100888 yes they are

EternumPace>>>) I thought Larry King was Jewish

zonkieone2 me to

Ygraine_ Myst, I got told last night that there is a website with a picture of my friend who wrote the poem I sent you sitting on a stone in Avebury

SS100888 he denounced Judaism for Mormonism

zonkieone2 why

Ygraine_ when I find the url, I'll send it to you

SS100888 His wife Shawn is Marie Osmonds best girlfriend

MystHuntr Ygraine - cool deal

EternumPace>>>) fascinating

Ygraine_ It's an BDO site

SS100888 yee of little information

zonkieone2 so what..he has been married so man ytimes mmaybe he is just mixed up ..thinks he is still married to them all

albertjaquaya do the "3" still walk the earth never finding death, a gift from god, ss?

EternumPace>>>) how would we denote where we are if we didn't know what geographical place we were living in?

SS100888 name the 3 al

SS100888 you think you are the authority name them

SS100888 and quote scripture while you are at it

Ygraine_ eternum, where we are might be many different things and concepts

zonkieone2 hmmmmm something to think about e pace

albertjaquaya moroni is one i think, the other 2 dont remember iam not moron

zonkieone2 LOL

albertjaquaya mormon sorry

SS100888 Moroni is an angel

--Redeemed-- ss,,,are you of the reorganized church,,??

albertjaquaya ah!

SS100888 nope

SS100888 and before you judge my religious belifes

EternumPace>>>) where is here?

SS100888 know that I do not lie, cheat, steal, smoke drinkl

zonkieone2 quite good ss

Ygraine_ here might be a place, a time, a construct around other people

zonkieone2 how do you do it

SS100888 I live my life and conduct the way of my life that my Father in Heaven wants me to

EternumPace>>>) a language?

SS100888 do what?

Ygraine_ yes, a language

albertjaquaya in my opionon mormon or judeo christianity, in short all who proclaim Jesus as savior is a child of god

zonkieone2 how do youknow where you are if there arent other people there.... are you really there

albertjaquaya simple

Ygraine_ zonkie, that's the old tree falls in a forest dilemma

EternumPace>>>) another good question, zonk

SS100888 huh?

zonkieone2 I am not a child of God in your eyes then..that is tobad..

--Redeemed-- ss,,,which have the thought that god was once a man,,,as we are now,,??

EternumPace>>>) "you cannot hear a shadow falling / do you hear the mysteies calling" dark tower

SS100888 We believe that every one is a daughter or son of jesus christ

albertjaquaya my eyes to you hold no weight, zonk

SS100888 whether you believe what we believe or not

EternumPace>>>) that sounds wonderful, SS

albertjaquaya free will good or evil

zonkieone2 i dont bellieve jesus is the son of God..i am jewish

albertjaquaya simple

SS100888 and that is fine zonkie

albertjaquaya deal with it

EternumPace>>>) is Language, then, the only real form of creativity, and is not our word for its locality, dream?

SS100888 do you not believe that we cannot love each other?

SS100888 inspite of philisophical differences?

zonkieone2 i dont believe....but i am okay with loving one another..i am an original flower child

Ygraine_ there is a philosophy going around at the moment, eternum, which states that everything is just a form of language

zonkieone2 language a state of mind

Ygraine_ try deShazer's Words were originally magik

zonkieone2 you can speak without speaking

SS100888 albert

--Redeemed-- ss,,,thank you for answering my questions,,!!

zonkieone2 through your eyes

zonkieone2 and your fingers

SS100888 you seem to claim to know so much about the chruch?

SS100888 what are 3 missions

SS100888 that we have to follow

EternumPace>>>) Ygraine, what is the nature of this philosophy?

SS100888 ............

albertjaquaya no ss i dont only a little bit, but a question ss if i may?

SS100888 once again waiting

Ygraine_ social constructionism

EternumPace>>>) can you tell me more, Ygraine?

SS100888 no you tell me what the doctrine of the church is

SS100888 1st

albertjaquaya "why was joseph murdered by his own people, in 1823 i think?"

SS100888 you tell me

EternumPace>>>) i believe everyone is a son or daughter of JC as well, or I would like to

SS100888 you seem to be a fountain of misinformation

SS100888 go ahead

Ygraine_ I have to get my notes out, Eternum, but it all hinges around perceptions being dependent on language and how reality is created

zonkieone2 eternum...i am not a daughter of JC

SS100888 amen y

albertjaquaya i ask a simple question if you dont know its okay

EternumPace>>>) that sounds utterly magical, Ygraine, do get your notes if it is convenient for you

SS100888 you are still loved

zonkieone2 i know that

SS100888 I have asked you endless simple questions al, for which you have no answers

zonkieone2 i am loved by God

zonkieone2 and others of course

SS100888 but would love to challenge me on my beliefs

albertjaquaya okay ss

SS100888 answer a few tought ????'s

EternumPace>>>) zonkie, within this thing called the imagination, JC can mean a lot of things

albertjaquaya forget it i digress

SS100888 yep its called selective memory

zonkieone2 ahhh... well inyour imagination.... what is jc

albertjaquaya no time for head games

albertjaquaya lol

SS100888 not playing them with you at all

zonkieone2 LOL

Ygraine_ Sandy, one thing you have to get used to here, is that Al never answers questions

SS100888 tell me if you know what the 3 fold mission of the church is

EternumPace>>>) in the heroic age, which could be this one as well, a HERo as Jesus et al could be anyone who could asnwer the question(s) why are we here, where are we going?

albertjaquaya just a play on words is all ss

SS100888 lmbo sug

zonkieone2 we are here to make others happy

zonkieone2 we are going to heaven.....................i hope

EternumPace>>>) so in this sense, zonkie, we are all children of ones who, in our psyches and for all intents, knew or know the answer to these questions or are or were the manifestations of such answers

SS100888 or put others down that don't believe what we believe

SS100888 Not!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ygraine_ Eternum, Lynch (1996) puts forward 3 basic epistomological positions relating to knowledge

albertjaquaya we are going where we send ourselves

EternumPace>>>) shoot, Ygraine.

zonkieone2 i suppose eternum

SS100888 if I were you I would be scared there al

SS100888 lol

albertjaquaya not here ss

Gwynhyvar brb

albertjaquaya k

Ygraine_ 1) there is an objective knowledge and we are able to have an objective knoweldge of this reality through the use of reason

SS100888 guess you will be preached the gospel in spiritual kingdom

SS100888 good for ya, you never ansswer the tough ???

zonkieone2 no preaching please...........hmmm but this is religions of the world isnt it

Ygraine_ 2) There is an objective order and meaning in reality but our knowledge of this is always constrained by our social context

EternumPace>>>) i would like to think so as werll, zonkie that is my "faith" i suppose

zonkieone2 ah well then.. preach away

zonkieone2 i have faith....

albertjaquaya many cant handel truth today maybe tommorrow ss

SS100888 gotta love ya zonkie

zonkieone2 i have to have faith

zonkieone2 thanks ss

Ygraine_ 3) There is no objective meaning to reality , all meaning is a human creation influence by social and cultural factors

EternumPace>>>) fascinatin, Ygraine

SS100888 gotta love anyone who shows respect for all of us and our differences

SS100888 thats what makes the world go around

zonkieone2 it does indeed

SS100888 nice mug lol

EternumPace>>>) ok, Ygraine, but what if the process of structure subjective worldview is itself meaninful ie in myth

SS100888 If I drank coffee it surely looks inviting lol

zonkieone2 i drink wine and it IS inviting

EternumPace>>>) i have to read that over again, Ygraine

Ygraine_ say that another way, eternum..I don't understand

SS100888 lol

SS100888 bless ya

zonkieone2 and you

SS100888 tyt

SS100888 I will take that to heart

zonkieone2 what is tyt?

SS100888 thank u too

zonkieone2 ohhh..good .okay..learn something new everyday..i like that

SS100888 I must go Ringo needs his run and I must go and do...

SS100888 I will be back later

zonkieone2 a dog....lucky...

SS100888 Al you aren't off the hook lol

albertjaquaya be well ss

EternumPace>>>) ok, Ygraine. there seems to indicate a process in deconstructing a reality to give us a reality? is that right?

zonkieone2 s

zonkieone2 cu

SS100888 see you all later

MystHuntr take care SS

SS100888 {{{{{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Ygraine_ bye Sandy

SS100888 bye

zonkieone2 bye

Ygraine_ yes

EternumPace>>>) so, then, Ygraine, perhaps this deconstructed reality can seap back in (my terms are crude I know), even aid in the perceptions of the social construct, ie in "myth"

Ygraine_ oh yes...all myths are teaching tales and have truth within them

zonkieone2 i have a pain in my neck.....really a pain in my neck....need to go work out...check out you cats on the morrow then..

zonkieone2 bye

Ygraine_ well that how I see them

zonkieone2 was fun

Ygraine_ bye zonkie

MystHuntr take care Zonkie

zonkieone2 by Y

albertjaquaya be well zonk

zonkieone2 by by y'all

EternumPace>>>) in point of reference, i take it that all children must forget all languages (or potential sound systems) in order to learn just one, their first

Ygraine_ I don't think so...they will learn more than one simulataneously if given the chance

EternumPace>>>) so just so energy can neither be created nor destroyed, information can not be "lost" only restructured, so that "all time" can live inside social time

Ygraine_ that sounds reasonable

albertjaquaya wow

EternumPace>>>) and what if this process benefits both the living and the dead, or it must, although I cannot prove it here

albertjaquaya wow

Ygraine_ both living and dead are just different vibrational parts of the great whole

albertjaquaya yes agree

EternumPace>>>) ok. good. we follow one another then

EternumPace>>>) you agree, albert?

Ygraine_ Hi ynica

MystHuntr afternoon ynica

albertjaquaya yes vibrational influnence is all we are

albertjaquaya hi yni

EternumPace>>>) packets of energy in motion?

albertjaquaya yes but do we learn?

ynica00 Hello everybody

EternumPace>>>) perhaps learning is synonymos with moving

albertjaquaya perhaps

MystHuntr the fact that wea re able to communicate proves that we learn

Ygraine_ yes, eternum...moving to a higher vibrational level

EternumPace>>>) perhaps language itself is a metaphor for reality, which is itself a metaphor for language

Ygraine_ they are both interlinked

Ygraine_ Hello joey

MystHuntr hey there Joey

albertjaquaya reality true reality has no laNGUAGE I THINK

joeyblu Hi I'm just checking this out.

EternumPace>>>) in term of information theory, must we make unclear equal parts that are made "clear"?

Ygraine_ there would still be communication, alberet, even if there were no language

albertjaquaya we just know without a spocken word but thought is still vibrational

albertjaquaya agree

albertjaquaya all is vibratory

EternumPace>>>) if i were to kill a small animal, take all its blood, would I be taking more information than I was giving?

albertjaquaya many levels there

albertjaquaya did you kill to kill or for food?

Ygraine_ those that became unclear would no longer be necessary to that level of exsistance

MystHuntr or kill just for the blood?

EternumPace>>>) the information

albertjaquaya the info it not through blood

MystHuntr which information though, how much blood does a small animal have?

EternumPace>>>) perhaps not, but its just an example, albert

albertjaquaya thats physical fluid

Ygraine_ blood is only information on a scientific basis

EternumPace>>>) we seem to have a few platonists among us. velvt also mentioned that informatoin is bodiless

albertjaquaya i think all must have a "contact" to understand spiritual

EternumPace>>>) what if this technology, these very computers are proof that that blood has information?

albertjaquaya or esls you read a book

Ygraine_ Hi Andy

Gwynhyvar back

Ygraine_ wb Gwyn

MystHuntr wb Gwyn

EternumPace>>>) interesting, the "anti-bodies"

EternumPace>>>) amusing and probably true

Gwynhyvar ty ty ty :-)

MystHuntr Pace - what kind of information are you looking for?

Ygraine_ that's what I'm wondering

albertjaquaya , lol

Ygraine_ do you mean that blood might give you the key to understanding the nature of the individual?

EternumPace>>>) probably the same info you are looking for

EternumPace>>>) for you are info

albertjaquaya pace?

albertjaquaya a question?

EternumPace>>>) isn't there a play about this, two people not wanting to be the first to give up info?

EternumPace>>>) lol

EternumPace>>>) this is fascinating

Ygraine_ probably, there's plays about most things

MystHuntr I'm not sure I'd use blood as a reference unless I was questioning the health of an animal

albertjaquaya pace are you sick?

EternumPace>>>) just a sec

MystHuntr Hey there Bella

DE_Bella34 heya

Ygraine_ blood always used to be used as a reference..., but I don't think we'd use it now

Ygraine_ Hi Bella

DE_Bella34 reference for what ygraine and hiya

EternumPace>>>) on the contrary, Ygraine, may I submit that that is Precisely why we should consider its importance

Ygraine_ but that is only if you consider blood to be a form of essence

albertjaquaya i gotta go all be well talk again soon

Ygraine_ blessings albert

MystHuntr take care Albert

EternumPace>>>) goodbye, albert. HNIWSH

DE_Bella34 many ancient cultures did

DE_Bella34 bleedin the white cow/bull to zeus etc

EternumPace>>>) Ygraine, I have made no assumptions as to what blood is but I will entertain many ideas

EternumPace>>>) for blood surely is

EternumPace>>>) blood may be the only thing anterior to language

DE_Bella34 so where is sugar and gwyn sleeping

Gwynhyvar Hiya sis!!! <hugs>

EternumPace>>>) i would you would consider anteriority, however, as a spacial designation within 4 dimensions

Ygraine_ there are other bodily fluids

Gwynhyvar *snicker*.....I`m awake...just playing elsewhere

DE_Bella34 ones awake giggles hiya

DE_Bella34 playin elsewhere?

Ygraine_ anteriority?

Gwynhyvar LOL.....getting graphics

Ygraine_ that's lovely Myst

MystHuntr thanks Ygraine

EternumPace>>>) i should digress

DE_Bella34 if ya see ones of a inside of a asylume grab for me please

Gwynhyvar sure thing

Ygraine_ go and look for some Munch...he was there long enough

EternumPace>>>) HNIWSH